Talk:Rose water
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I moved this page without discussion, as I do not think it is controversial. However, if anyone disagrees with me, please feel free to change it back and/or take the matter to requested moves. By far the most common spelling for the substance seems to be "rose water". That is what the American Heritage Dictionary has, as do two reference books about food. One of the books is published by the Oxford University Press, so I am guessing that there is no difference between American and British spellings. I also searched Google for both versions. "Rose water" returned websites talking about the substance, but "rosewater" seemed to mostly refer to a surname. -- Kjkolb (talk) 00:17, 25 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
The sentence says "due to the prohibition of alcohol consumption in Islamic countries." Alcohol is not banned in all Islamic countries, it is widely available in several of them (UAE, Qatar, Oman, Turkey, Malaysia, Syria, etc) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.167.250.43 (talk) 06:27, 18 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Islam does not forbid ethyl alcohol as a solvent for technical use, and the use of alcohol in perfumery is also allowed. The prohibition of ethyl alcohol in some Islamic countries refers to fermented and distilled alcohol for oral use and as an intoxicant. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.1.72.125 (talk) 21:47, 16 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]
"Rose water is a calque of Persian word Golab (Persian: گلاب)." That sounds odd to me. Doesn't Golab, like Gulab in other countries, refer to the flower, the colour, etc., not specifically the rose water? Nadiatalent (talk) 19:04, 26 September 2011 (UTC)[reply]
REPLY: http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=julep&allowed_in_frame=0the webpage above confirms that rose water comes from Golab or Jolab, (gol=rose, aab = water)89.242.248.91
Oh come on. The link above claims that "julep" comes from the Persian "golab" meaning rose-water. It doesn't claim that the English phrase "rose water" is a calque of "golab." That doesn't even make sense. Rose water is called rose water because it is water mixed with roses. It's no surprise that multiple languages use their previously-existing words for "rose" and "water" to describe a mix of water and rose petals. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.12.183.84 (talk) 20:11, 2 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
How does rose essence relate to rose water and other rose products? Nadiatalent (talk) 18:37, 12 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]
"In the United States, rose syrup is used to make rose scones and marshmallows."
This...I just don't know quite what to say. It may be factually correct, but...but...You could probably say the same of France, or Germany or England or anywhere else they may make scones or marshmallows. It would be more correct and less misleading to say, "rose syrup may be used in baking and confectionery, for example in making rose scones or marshmallows...as seen..." But it's also use in flavoring pastries made with phyllo, and in pastries in Asian countries, in beverges all over the world!
Rose syrup is used all over the world, most prominently in Asia and the Middle East, less so in Europe and the Americas.
"A rose water ointment is occasionally used as an emollient..."
Two things (at least)...rosewater is used in cosmetics because it smells good. Yes, it is claimed to have certain desireable properties in addition to a pleasing aroma but this is another case where it would be better to say that "rosewater is used in cosmetic and beauty preparations..." and expand on that a bit.
And you're leaving out the old, centuries, I'd guess, standby: glycerine and rosewater lotion. Really, centuries. Maybe millenia. It's common all over the world, even today, with many commercial products available, although it is easily made at home. Zlama (talk) 21:27, 23 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Although this sentence has long been tagged as needing a citation, I'd like to challenge it here, in case anyone does have a reliable cite for it. "Until 350 years ago rose water, or gol-aab, was only distilled in Persia..." From 'Economic History of Medieval India, 1200-1500' p. 56, "How extensively the production of rose water had spread through throughout [India] by this time is indicated by the low prices that Ibn Battuta in ['Rihla'] recorded of rose water in the mid 1340s in Bengal: it fetched no more than half the price of ghee of the same weight." (ghee=butter) Supposedly an old (11th century?) Sanskrit book, called Ark-prakash, attributes the discovery of rosewater to Nagarjuna, ca 200 CE, and while I have my doubts about that, I think that claims of a Persian monopoly of over 6 centuries really need some good references to keep from disappearing. 173.228.54.175 (talk) 16:30, 27 October 2014 (UTC)[reply]
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since vedic times, indians knew rose water and has been mentioned in several texts including bhagwat geeta, charaka samhita etc i think this page needs to mention that indians knew rose water since very ancient times, it may just be that avisena made the process more economical and cheap. It is also claimed that rose attar was first made by persians even though indians already knew rose water and attars, so indians must have known rose attars.
Research Report for Historical Study of Attars and essence making in Kannauj
The rose comes from ancient times in India as per record of
old Sanskrit literature as “Tarunipushpa”, “Atimanjula” and“Semantika”. Rose growing in India developed with distillation ofroses mentioned in Ayurveda by Charaka around 100 A.D. With theadvent of Mughal Emperor Babur in 1526 begins the history ofIndian rose industry, when the Persian rose or Damask rose (Rosa
damascena) was introduced in India from Persia.
202.188.53.210 (talk) 05:56, 12 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]
The text describing the production of rose water as likely originating in Persia was removed, and replaced with the following:
Bhagavat Gita describes the use of sandal wood and rose water being sprayed at the Swayamvara of Draupadi.[1]
I have reverted that edit, because despite the citation, the statement is highly dubious. The story of the Swayamvara of Draupadi is not contained in the Bhagavad Gita, but in the Adi Parva. I checked two translations of the Swayamvara Parva in the Adi Parva, and only sandal water paste is mentioned, not rose water. Dutt's translation: "It resounded with the notes of thousands of trumpets, — it was scented with Aguru (black aloe), ornamented with garlands and sprinkled with the sandal water paste."[2] Ganguli's translation: "And resounding with the notes of thousands of trumpets, it was scented with black aloes and sprinkled all over with water mixed with sandal-paste and decorated with garlands of flowers."[3] A search found no instance of the phrase "rose water" anywhere in the Mahabharata.
I also searched three translations of the Bhagavad Gita, none of which contain the phrase "rose water". I wasn't able to find any other information through a Google search about rose water being mentioned in the Bhagavad Gita. Finally, the provided source itself on page 37 goes on to say: "In his studies in the History of Indian Cosmetics and Perfumery, Prof. P. K. Gode outlines the chronology of rose flower, rose water and rose attar from 2000 BC in which he has traced the import of rose to India from Farsistan in Persia between 810 and 817 AD." --IamNotU (talk) 18:11, 2 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]
@Trople: Edit warring is not the solution, i suggest we discuss here as per WP:BRD. Thanks. I think that you misunderstood WP:NPOV, it's not against the inclusion of the statement you removed, it says that "All encyclopedic content on Wikipedia must be written from a neutral point of view (NPOV), which means representing fairly, proportionately, and, as far as possible, without editorial bias, all the significant views that have been published by reliable sources on a topic.", i.e. if you have sources that contradict the claim about Qamsar making the best rose water in the world, please provide them and we will reword the lede. Best.---Wikaviani (talk) (contribs) 20:30, 31 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Iran accounts for 90% of world production.[2](Redacted)
We can't copy from Encylopedia Iranica; it's not compatibly licensed. Sorry,— Diannaa (talk) 19:05, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Central Iran is home to the annual Golabgiri festival each spring. Thousands of tourists visit the area to celebrate the rose harvest for the production of golāb.[1][2]
— Diannaa (talk) 20:17, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 12 January 2023 and 24 April 2023. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Fieryraisins (article contribs).
— Assignment last updated by IamBookcat (talk) 01:22, 7 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]
@Bon courage: Hi, may i suggest you read what the sources say before labeling my edits as "not improving" ? Thank you.---Wikaviani (talk) (contribs) 07:29, 17 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I will make another proposal here on the talk when i have time for that, feel free to comment it.---Wikaviani (talk) (contribs) 14:32, 17 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
@Bon courage: I suggest to reword the sentence as follows :"Rose water likely originated in Persia,[sources 6, 7 and 8] however, before the development of the technique of distilling rose water, rose petals were already used in Persian cuisine to perfume and flavor dishes.[source 6]". Sounds closer to what the sources say.---Wikaviani (talk) (contribs) 20:48, 23 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]